Ep: 23 Andrew Glincher on Leadership and Values

Andrew Glincher, CEO & Managing Partner of Nixon Peabody, on Leadership and Values

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Here are some highlights of my interview with Andrew Glincher:

One of the things that I’ve always believed in leadership is that everybody is a leader. It doesn’t matter what your role is in an organization.

As a business person, the most important thing is you have to keep making decisions. Sometimes you’ll be right, sometimes you’ll be wrong. But the worst thing in the world for most businesses is not to make a decision.

We deal with elevator assets, our assets go home every night. They have the choice whether or not they want to come back the next day. We need to make sure Nixon Peabody is the place people want to come back to the next day. You can’t take that for granted.

I’ve got Lincoln right up in my office here along with all the Lincoln stamps and Lincoln coins. He stands for strong values and discipline in times of crisis.

You need to have a moral authority to lead. You need to have strong values. You need to be able to communicate clearly.

I look at a lot of the business leaders and [wonder] if they really resonate with the people that come in day in and day out and work so hard to make their organization successful. But I think that type of emotional intelligence and connecting – if you can’t connect with your folks, if you can’t build trust, you really don’t have much of anything.

I think it’s important that you be empathetic to everyone and that you understand everybody’s in different positions and whenever possible you speak up for people that don’t have a voice.

One of the things that’s so great about this job is I listen and learn from my colleagues. I always learn new things.  

I have read a lot about Buffet over the years and long admired him mainly because of his personal values, his willingness to not sugarcoat things and speak from the heart and his low key lifestyle given that he’s one of the wealthiest men in the world.

I also in many ways look at a law firm as an investment business, where each year for your strategy you need to be nimble and strategic and you need to understand where you should be investing perhaps more money in different parts of our business or practices and at a different time.

I’m really not looking at what’s today’s talent. If you don’t have new people and the diversity of people, then you don’t end up with new ideas and a diversity of ideas.

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Links referred to in this episode:

Andrew Glincher’s Web Bio

Andrew’s Twitter Handle

Abraham Lincoln | 16th US President 

Brad Stevens | Head Coach of Boston Celtics

Alex Cora | Manager of the Boston Red Socks

Warren Buffett | Chairman and CEO of Berkshire Hathaway

The Snowball: Warren Buffett and the Business of Life by Alice Schroeder

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Audio Transcription 

To Download the PDF Transcript, click here. (Look in the top right corner and click on the three dots to download.)
Hi listeners, this is Chris Batz, your host of the Law Firm Leadership podcast. In today’s episode, I had a wonderful conversation with a known Am Law 100 law firm leader, Andrew Glincher of Nixon Peabody. Not surprising, leadership was the focus of our conversation. Andrew reflected on his decisions he made weathering the 2008 crisis and preparing for the next one. Also, Andrew wouldn’t be sharing about leadership unless he talked about Abraham Lincoln and Warren Buffet.
Just a reminder the PDF transcript of this audio is available to download. Go to LionGroupRecruiting.com/podcast.
As many of you know, we interview corporate defense, law firm leaders, partners, general counsels, and legal consultants. You’re listening to episode twenty-three of the Law Firm Leadership podcast.
Chris: Welcome to the Law Firm Leadership podcast. I’m your host, Chris Batz, with the Lion Group. Today I have the pleasure of speaking with Andrew Glincher, CEO and managing partner of Nixon Peabody.
Andrew lives in Boston and leads an Am Law 100 law firm with 1,500 colleagues, of which 700 are attorneys, across 1,700 offices. He received his law degree from Northeastern University School of Law. Welcome Andrew to the Law Firm Leadership podcast. It’s great to have you on the show.
Andrew: Thank you Chris. It’s a pleasure to be on.
Chris: Now Andrew, as a fan of leadership myself and I’ve been watching many law firm leaders around the United States, your name definitely comes up regularly. While in law school has it always been an aspiration of yours to be say a managing partner of a law firm or a law large firm?
Andrew: I have a business background and taught at Boston College’s Business School for 23 years. I love business and have been involved in business. I always felt that I would use my law degree to run some sort of business, I just never thought that that business would be a law firm.
Chris: How long have you been the managing partner/CEO at Nixon Peabody?
Andrew: I’m in my eighth year of having the privilege to run the firm.

We’re focused on what we can do best

Chris: Let’s talk about the firm for a moment. You had shared with me earlier that it’s just been special and important past couple of years, record breaking. Can you explain a little about that to us?
Andrew: I don’t think our business will look very similar today in five years and especially ten years down the road. There are a lot of law firms that are trying to be a lot of things to a lot of different people. We’re focused on what we can do best, where we can provide the greatest value for our clients. That strategy of focusing where you can make the most impact has really been helpful.
As part of that, the importance of knowing and understanding our client’s business has been paramount. The law firm of the future and indeed even the law firm of today dictates that you need to be beyond a lawyer. Lawyers need to learn their client’s businesses on their own dime and to help focus clients on their business, on their strategy to be ahead of where they are today so you can help solve what are essentially business problems.
Clients today don’t come to lawyers like they used to looking to have you tell them the statute of limitations or some basic law question. It’s usually they’re looking for a collaborative relationship of mutually beneficial partnership that is going to enhance their business.
Chris: With that same theme of doing law differently or as the industry has evolved, where has Nixon Peabody fit in that picture?
Andrew: When we were looking at how we’re perceived by our clients and indeed the world, we were told that what folks like about us is that we seem to like each other and work well together. We enjoy collaborating and work well on teams. We look at each other’s strengths and play off those strengths.

Leadership Opportunities Attract Talent

Chris: Tell me about some of the environment that you’re creating culturally, say for leadership for your laterals as you’re adding people on your team. Why are people coming to Nixon Peabody and staying?
Andrew: Well, it’s a very entrepreneurial culture. Part of that stems from my background and part of it stems from when I took over this role, I sat one night reading an Am Law magazine, looking at the top 100 firms in the world. I realized that each firm sort of looked like the other firm, that there were no firms that really stuck out. At that point it became apparent to me that if you could somehow differentiate your firm, even one small iota, it could help make a huge difference.
One of the things that I’ve always believed in leadership is that everybody is a leader. It doesn’t matter what your role is in an organization. I have tried to give people opportunities, even though they might not be readily apparent a part of leadership at the present time. I’ve had folks that are less experienced, more junior in the partnership ranks than others and I’ve recognized certain interpersonal skills, emotional intelligence, hard work, grit, determination and put them in leadership positions such as an office managing partner role or practice group leadership, not because so much of what they’ve accomplished today, but what they can accomplish.
I’m really not looking at what’s today’s talent. If you’re looking at today’s talent, you’re going to do the same old, same old. If you recycle the same population, you don’t end up with new people. If you don’t have new people and the diversity of people, then you don’t end up with new ideas and a diversity of ideas. We’ve given those types of opportunities.
Laterals are our best salespeople for new laterals and M&A for our firm. We’ve had laterals join us where I recognize leadership ability and I’ve asked them to take on leadership roles such as office managing partner. They’ve done that sometimes in their first year or so. They’ve done it very successfully.
Folks that come to us from other firms or companies really are people that believe in the vision and the mission because they’ve been other places, they see that what we’re doing is different. Every managing partner I’ve ever met will tell you that they believe they have a good culture.

Use of Space and Planning for Change

Chris: Let’s talk about change. In the next five to ten years, Andrew, when do you see change on the horizon for large law firms and how are you planning for this?
Andrew: Change is occurring around us rapidly. People can take a look at technology and how technology has changed the way we work. Having voice mail was a big thing. Now if you leave a voicemail for somebody that’s of Millennial age, that is very uncool. They see that there is no need. My kids will remind me, “There’s no need to you to leave a voicemail. I know you called. I can see it via missed call.” Technology has obviously changed.
For lawyers, you can’t just print out a document and think that you’re going to add value for a client. It has to be much, much more than that.
We are seeing how we use space change.
2015 which really started in 2013, I started planning for single size offices for all attorneys at Nixon Peabody. I believe we were one of the first law firms, if not the first, to do this. We’ve done it now in Washington DC and Los Angeles and New York City, now Boston and San Francisco.
Originally it was a challenge. Partners were giving up large offices, corner offices. We made the corners into conference rooms. Really they’re collaboration rooms. They’re smaller rooms where people can collaborate. We’ve done all glass offices so that so the views and openness of space would lead to more people working together, closer together, collaborating closer together. It’s really enhanced the way I think that we do business. That being said, we’ve reduced our footprint by about a third for the same headcount. In the future, I think five – ten years down the road, folks are going to look and say, “Why do we need this much space?”
Chris: I know that you became the managing partner and CEO I think it was around 2010 or was it 2009?
Andrew: December of 2010.
Chris: What was your role, Andrew, before then?
Andrew: Before then I was the managing partner of the Boston office for seven years, which is our largest office.

Weathering the Next Financial Crisis

Chris: Let me ask you this question about weathering storms. Everyone is asking when is the next economic downturn. How was it weathering the storm in 2008 – 2009? You basically took on the helm of the firm in a pretty difficult economic season for all law firms and yet you pick up that role. Explain to me kind of what you went through in that and how you’re preparing for the next one.
Andrew: We have no debt and I’m proud of that. I’m very fiscally conservative. I didn’t feel at the time that I had a great amount of wiggle room. You couldn’t afford to be wrong in a major way. For lawyers, if you just went by your traditional legal background, that would be a very tough thing for most people.
As a business person, the most important thing is you have to keep making decisions. You cannot do anything to delay making decisions. Sometimes you’ll be right, sometimes you’ll be wrong. But the worst thing in the world for most businesses is not to make a decision.
We were fiscally very conservative, but we still invested heavily in marketing and in knowledge management and things that would improve how we are able to service our clients and focus really on playing to our strengths. What is it that we do well? We committed to our values and that went a long way.
Chris, when you speak about the next recession, I mean that will come. Everything comes in cycles.
We are better positioned leadership-wise. One of the things that was a priority for me was leadership development. That meant bringing more people into the inner circle, giving them exposure as to how we do things, what we do. Financially, we’re in better position because we have no debt. Our client relationships are stronger than ever, though you can’t be complacent about that or take it for granted for a second because of the competition, which is intense for clients. You always have to be providing your clients with exceptional service and quality of work.
We’ve established leases in many places. Our staffing is excellent in terms of providing value but needs to continue to evolve. Economically, financially, I think emotionally, which does play a part because we deal with elevator assets, our assets go home every night. They have the choice whether or not they want to come back the next day. We need to make sure Nixon Peabody is the place people want to come back to the next day. You can’t take that for granted.

The Telling Qualities of Abraham Lincoln and the Next Law Firm Leader

Chris: Let me ask you this question. Think of the future law firm leader of today, maybe taking over the next largest law firm. If you were to combine a couple different individuals, either alive or dead today, what kind of people would you put together, say famous, to make the next law firm leader?
Andrew: Well, I’ve always admired Abraham Lincoln. My office is at the intersection of Lincoln and Summer Street. I collect Lincoln pennies. I’ve got Lincoln right up in my office here along with all the Lincoln stamps and Lincoln coins for strong values and discipline in times of crisis. You need to have a moral authority to lead. You need to have strong values. You need to be able to communicate clearly.
Although one of Abraham Lincoln’s famous quotes was, “If I had a long time, I could write you a short letter.” I always found that to be humorous because people go on and on, but he could communicate succinctly despite making fun of the about of time that it took. You need a high degree today of emotional intelligence and interpersonal skills. You need to be relatable to all of those people and often your people span multiple generations.

Boston Sports Models of Emotional Intelligence

Chris: Who do you think currently, maybe someone separate than Abraham Lincoln that would model good emotional intelligence today?
Andrew: Take a look at the manager of the Boston Red Sox, new manager Alex Cora. I can look at the coach of, Brad Stevens with the Celtics. They both seem to be relatable. I think they’re both less experienced, but they definitely are relatable to their players and their players get what’s going on.
I look at a lot of the business leaders and you’re not really sure when you look at some of the business leaders today if they really resonate with the people that come in day in and day out and work so hard to make their organization successful. But I think that type of emotional intelligence and connecting – if you can’t connect with your folks, if you can’t build trust, you really don’t have much of anything.

Moral Authority and Being Grounded as a Leader

Chris: Knowing that moral authority was really critical to Abraham Lincoln, do you have any personal history of moral authority or where that grounded you as a leader?
Andrew: Personal history. My parents and grandparents always taught me that you’ve got to stand up for folks that were underserved. My attitude has always been to be a voice for those who maybe weren’t as represented and stand up for underdogs.
For that reason, I never thought when I joined what was a big firm of 60 lawyers that I would ever stay. I gave it a year at a time. But the reason I did stay was I really loved the people. Even though people didn’t always agree with me, they did let me voice my opinion. I was in a culture where it was okay to voice your opinion even though sometimes I would be given a hard time, it was okay to do.
I think it’s important that you be empathetic to everyone and that you understand everybody’s in different positions and whenever possible you speak up for people that don’t have a voice. I’ve been able to do that here. I’ve been able to do that in my charitable endeavors and community endeavors. I just feel a duty to do that.
If you ask about moral authority or doing those things that’s it. I’m not a perfect person. I make plenty of mistakes. I just am on a lifelong self-improvement mission. Everybody I work with I try to instill that we all need to keep learning and keep reinventing ourselves. Lifelong learning is really important.
One of the things that’s so great about this job is I listen and learn from my colleagues. I always learn new things. You can never think that you know it all or know most of it or anything. As soon as you do that, you’re sort of history in my opinion. You have to always evolve and learn and understand different perspectives and different views so that you can then help make the best decision as possible for your organization.

Admirer of Warren Buffett

Chris: When I hear you say lifelong learning, that reminds me because I attended the Berkshire Hathaway shareholder event. Do you speak from admiration of Mr. Buffet and Munger?
Andrew: I do. I don’t know Charlie Munger as much. I do know Warren Buffet. I have read a lot about Buffet over the years and long admired him mainly because of his personal values, his willingness to not sugarcoat things and speak from the heart and his low key lifestyle given that he’s one of the wealthiest men in the world. Also his benevolence.
But he’s just had a lot of practical advice about really knowing businesses and not buying things that you don’t use, things like that. I do admire Warren Buffet a great deal.
I also in many ways look at a law firm as an investment business, where each year for your strategy you need to be nimble and strategic and you need to understand where you should be investing perhaps more money in different parts of our business or practices and at a different time.
You need to keep an even keel. It’s important to be balanced, to have balanced perspective and balanced judgment and recognize that some things, while they may seem of earthshattering importance at the moment, if you ask whether or not that will mean something three to five years down the road and if the answer is it isn’t, then it won’t then maybe you look at it with a different perspective and you don’t become overwhelmed by it.

What’s the One Thing

Chris: If you could pick one habit that someone could do or that you would have done consistently from your 20s, what would that be?
Andrew: I think persistence goes a long way. If you want something and want to do something, if you work really hard at it, I really believe it’s possible for most people.

Routine and Personal Values

Chris: How important is routine to you? Do you have a morning routine or a different type of routine?
Andrew: Having good habits and good routines helps you be balanced and it helps you be excellent at what you do. I get up early. I try and work out when I first get up because I know once my day starts and I get into the office, I’m not the type that can just get out of the office.
I tell people to strive for balance because balance gives you better perspective and judgment. I encourage people to spend time with their families because I think that’s really important. You don’t make really good decisions if you’re tired all of the time or if you’re not balanced. I force myself if I don’t remember to do it to take walks, to go outside and get grounded.
Sometimes just a breath of fresh air, walking around the block for a couple of times on a crazy day can give you better balance, better thinking, better perspective. You try and do that. You can’t always control your own schedule, but you can control your routine and your time discipline and what you’re focused on doing and doing better.

What’s on Andrew’s Book Shelf

Chris: Andrew, are you a reader and do you have any book recommendations for the summer? Anything that you plan on reading?
Andrew: I’ve been reading Warren Buffet’s Snowball forever. That’s an older book. The big joke is my wife probably reads a new book every week. She keeps asking me to read books for fun and passion. I read so much for my business, so much in legal and business that my eyes are tired and I don’t read much for fun. My fun reading is different blogs, different articles, the Wall Street Journal, Boston Globe, New York Times.
Chris: Do you and your family have plans for the summer, ways to enjoy either sports or travel?
Andrew: I like to get away in the winter more is my time. The summer allows me to sort of catch up because the rest of the world takes time. But I enjoy any time at all walking around the beaches is awesome. I enjoy the fresh air of the beach and going for walks and exercising by the beach.

I Want to be a Talk Show Host

Chris: Very good. I know it’s been said that 10,000 hours makes someone an expert doing something. Andrew, if you were to be an expert in a certain skill that took that many hours to do that’s not necessarily law related, what skill would that be?
Andrew: I want to be a talk show host.
Chris: Andrew thank you so much for being on the show and just setting aside your valuable time to just share some insights on your life and the way you lead. Again, thank you. I appreciate it.
Andrew: Well, thank you Chris. This was fun. As I tell my colleagues, you have to have some fun.
Chris: You do.
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